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Are you for or against spanking??

2

Re: Are you for or against spanking??

  • I would prefer my children respect me as a parent and an adult than fear the pain I could inflict on them.  Spanking is a quick, easy way to get your point across and stop the action that is causing you anger, disappointment, irritation, etc.  Other methods of discipline will take longer for that effect,and a certain level of maturity in the child to understand it, however it is a long term effect.  My 10 year old has hit the point of respect, and when he gets into trouble in school (or whatever the case may be) after his punishment is handed out (be it taking away electronics or missing a hockey game, whatever) he is saddened by the fact that he disappointed us rather than fearful of physical pain.  And he doesn't want to have that on a regular basis, therefore he is rarely in trouble, rarely needs discipline, and is basically a good kid, albeit somewhat headstrong in many ways.  He is still his own person, but prefers to hear "we are so proud of you" than see the disappointment in our eyes.  I know this because he has come to us and said he is so sorry for making us disappointed, and he will try not to do it again.  (Just as I try not to disappoint them, by following through with things and taking care of them to the best of my ability) He respects us and in turn, we respect him for being the child he is.  And when he is in trouble, (as no child is perfect, obviously)  after the discipline is handed out, and the discussion is over, when I go to hug him and tell him I still love him, he doesn't flinch. 

    Obviously there is a fine line between fear and respect, I know that.  However I want them to fear the punishment that will be handed out, fear the feeling of disappointment, but not fear physical pain, or me and DH.

    Every child is different, and maybe I am lucky that I have never had to resort to spanking, I don't know.  I just know in my house, we have pretty good kids and have never resorted to it.

  • image annabelle.27:
    you remind me of those people who say "I smoke three packs a day and I'm not worried because my grandpa smoked and lived to be 98 so obviously the statistics are wrong."

    My thoughts exactly. Research is great, until it says something I don't want to hear. Then it's bunk.

    I think spanking is wrong. Besides the research about why it is not a good choice of discipline, I have a moral objection to it. I'm baffled why hitting adults is battery, yet hitting a child is discipline. If my assistant does something wrong, I can't just whack her ass. Yet I can do it to a child. Why?

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  • image lisa2008boo:
      Call me old fashion but that is evidence enough for me if it is a method that has been around for hundreds of years then it must be working. Just because something is old doesn't mean it should just be regarded it means it has survived for so long for a reason.

    You know, for thousands of years man was creating fire by striking rocks or rubbing sticks together. It worked, so we should just keep making fire that way, right?

    That's one of the brilliant things about humans. That whole big brain of ours lets us figure out better ways to do things, not just relying on what we've always done.

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  • image lisa2008boo:
    That research is fine if that is what works for you and your family then that's fine you can raise your kids how ever you see fit. You have your rights and I have mine and until they make it illegal to spank my kids for severe bad behavior then it is the method I choose. Research is great but I find human experience to be more reliable. And everyone I know has been spanked all are productive members of society none are violent or have criminal issues besides minor things here and there. So it all depends on the family and the kids and whatever the parents finds works for them and there kids is what they should do every child is different. I may have a totally calm obedient child that only needs a warning and I don;t ever have to spank them. Or I may have one who bucks the system all the time and never wants to listen and will have to spank them. Different personalities make for different children.
    I'm not convinced that you are a normal, productive member of society. You sound angry, defensive and kinda clueless about early childhood development. 

    I was spanked as a child. I remember it. I don't remember what I did wrong or what I was supposed to learn. I just remember the spanking. I know it was the acceptable form of discipline back then, but there is so much more information today and better methods advocated today, that continuing the cycle of abuse (yes, its abuse) is absurd.  My own mother today would tell you it was wrong and she regrets it. I have raised two teens that are respectful, considerate, and kind and never once resorted to striking them.

  • Ah. So you don't have children yet, and you're already committed to striking any that you might have in future. Let me guess; you see lots of bad little kids whose parents never discipline them at all, and when YOU have kids, they're never going to act like that because you're going to hit them.

    Lovely.

    everyone knows that you don't strike animals in order to train them. Not just because it's cruel, but because, most clearly, it doesn't work to stop the behavior you want to extinguish.  Every animal trainer will tell you that. Children are just little animals, like any other. I can't imagine you'd hit your dog if it did something wrong; why on earth would you hit a child?

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  • I was spanked, it didn't kill me....but at the same time I think there are better methods to use and so we will not be spanking out kids.  I don't think you can spank a kid without feeling anger, and if you're too angry when you spank you could get carried away/hit harder than you'd like..and it could just show a violent action to a child as a way to deal with people doing things that they shouldn't towards you.

    I think it CAN work but I think it's a fine line that I'd be afraid of crossing.

  • I don't reason with my toddlers.  They're developmentally incapable of understanding it.  And the more I talk, the less they hear when they're angry or frustrated.

    Imagine how difficult it is to be a toddler.  You're small and weak and you can't say everything you want to say or do everything you want to do, and the big people around you keep telling you no.  You can't handle your emotions effectively and you're dependent on other people.  No wonder they melt down and act like they're uncivilized!

    I've found it's very effective to remove my children from the situation when they're at a breaking point.  Sometimes it's as small as taking them from the table if they're throwing food.  Sometimes it's as big as carrying them to their cribs if they're doing something dangerous or aggressive.  The cooling-off period helps both of us settle down.

    If they act up in public, we leave!

    FWIW, my kids aren't spanked or screamed at, and they're very well-behaved.  Better behaved, in fact, than my niece and nephew who are spanked and smacked on the hands and yelled at.  Since you love anecdotal evidence so much, chew on that.

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  • One time, when N was around 1 1/2, I was changing her diaper and she kept grabbing at it and pulling it away.  I got very frustrated and tapped her lightly on the hand, the first time I've ever done something like that.  I'll never forget the look in her eyes as she cried.  It was "Why would you hit me?  I was just playing."  My tap didn't hurt her physically, but it really hurt her feelings.  That look broke my heart and I've never even so much as tapped her again.
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  • image scherza:

    FWIW, my kids aren't spanked or screamed at, and they're very well-behaved.  Better behaved, in fact, than my niece and nephew who are spanked and smacked on the hands and yelled at.  Since you love anecdotal evidence so much, chew on that.

    Eh, this will probably just fall in the same category as "research" to her and she'll ignore it.  SHE doesn't know them, so it doesn't count. 
    "Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
    ~Benjamin Franklin

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  • From the OP's bio: 
    Hey I'm Lisa I'm 20 Years old I just married my 8th grade sweet heart We don;t have any kids yet and don;t want any for awhile
     
     
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    You are really way too young to be a parent. Actually, a lot of women on these boards will tell you that you are way to young to be married.
     
    Please don't breed for at least another 5 years. Ten would be preferable in your case.
    Hope is not a strategy.
  • image scherza:

    I don't reason with my toddlers.  They're developmentally incapable of understanding it.  And the more I talk, the less they hear when they're angry or frustrated.

    Imagine how difficult it is to be a toddler.  You're small and weak and you can't say everything you want to say or do everything you want to do, and the big people around you keep telling you no.  You can't handle your emotions effectively and you're dependent on other people.  No wonder they melt down and act like they're uncivilized!

    I've found it's very effective to remove my children from the situation when they're at a breaking point.  Sometimes it's as small as taking them from the table if they're throwing food.  Sometimes it's as big as carrying them to their cribs if they're doing something dangerous or aggressive.  The cooling-off period helps both of us settle down.

    If they act up in public, we leave!

    FWIW, my kids aren't spanked or screamed at, and they're very well-behaved.  Better behaved, in fact, than my niece and nephew who are spanked and smacked on the hands and yelled at.  Since you love anecdotal evidence so much, chew on that.

    I just got married and am nowhere near breeding, but I'll throw in my two cents. I like all of the above post, but the part in bold is pretty much the strategy I've contemplated. For me, time outs -- being taken away from the fun and excitement -- were an effective method of correction. When I got older, my parents took away the book I was reading for a few days.

    I plan to avoid spanking and angry yelling because I have to be pretty angry to yell now, and I don't want to be in that emotional state when I'm trying to discipline/educate (because they go hand in hand) my kids.

  • image EastCoastBride:

    image lisa2008boo:
    Look at kids today who weren't spanked they are drinking young having sex doing drugs running all over the place have no respect for their elders. Now compare that to the older generations who were spanked they would never even think of doing or saying half the things kids today do. Call me old fashion but that is evidence enough for me if it is a method that has been around for hundreds of years then it must be working. Just because something is old doesn't mean it should just be regarded it means it has survived for so long for a reason.
    OMG.  I was willing to have a rational discussion w/ you on this topic, but w/ this- you've lost me. 

    WIth this, you are basically telling me that you see spanking as the only form of discipline out there.  If kids aren't spanked, they aren't disciplined. 

    LOL.

    ECB, what you quoted was a red flag for me too.  From all the responses of the OP, it sounds like she is close-minded and her intentions for coming on this message board was not to have an open, fruitful conversation on the topic of spanking.  Instead, she just wanted us all to talk "at" each other: "Oh I spank"; "No I don't spank"; "I spank sometimes", zzzzzz.  Many challenge her decisions, and she gets defensive.  I hope this isn't an indication of how she views the world, where learning stops at high school or college graduation.  (I am aware I'm being blunt.)  For my DH and I, we do learn from our previous generations, but we also know generations evolve  because of daily/monthly/yearly learnings we will naturally do things differently because of new knowledge gained. 

    I have a set of cousins who were spanked and they are the craziest bunch of bullies.  However, that is only a small percentage of the reason why we choose not to spank our future children.  If she were to respond to this, I would like to know if she thinks "old fashioned" equals "close-mindedness"?

  • I guess my thing with having a "last resort" punishment- be it spanking or yelling or whatever- is: What are you going to do when you go through everything and you do your last resort punishment and the child stands there, glaring defiantly at you with a "So?" I teach very young children, and teaching them- how to behave well, how not to behave, how to handle their frustration- requires a lot more than a behavior plan like "First we'll do X, and if X doesn't work, then Y, and if Y doesn't work, then we'll do Z as a last resort." Because there will always be that child for whom Z doesn't work, or doesn't have any impact on them, and then what are you going to do if you've already used your "last resort?" And if your last resort was spanking, what are you going to do? Spank harder? Spank longer? It works much better to figure out the cause- why the child is doing the behavior- and have them experience the natural consequence or change the circumstances so that the cause of the behavior doesn't exist (redirecting).  I.e., if you scream in a restaurant, we will leave, because people do not scream in restaurants.  If you kick the toy, I take it away, because if you don't take care of something you cannot have it.  If you throw the sand after I told you not to, that means you are not ready to play nicely with sand.  Go play with X instead.  Etc.  

    And- I gotta say.  It's illegal for a teacher to spank or swat or otherwise corporally punish a student.   It's also illegal to swat or spank another adult.  Why would I do to my child what I wouldn't do to anyone else? 

  • Actually, MrsG, corporal punishment is legal -- with written parental permission -- in several states.  A friend of mine taught in a school that paddled students for misbehavior.  In high school.  In 2010.

    That kind of blew my mind.

    OP, if you're still reading, I have to say that your goal -- not raising brats -- is good, but your philosophy is backwards.  If you focus on what you're going to do to curb negative behavior (i.e., spanking), then your focus is on the negative behavior all the time.  That will be exhausting for you and for the children concerned.

    If your focus is on promoting positive behavior, you will find that discipline is a much easier and less painful task.  Sure, you still have to correct negative behavior, but you have to do it less frequently, and since it isn't your focus point, you won't be so worn out when you have to deal with Junior dropping peas on the floor for the fifteenth time.  Think about what behaviors you want your children to embrace; model those behaviors; praise them to the skies when they do them; try to "catch them doing good"; and handle misbehavior as a brief aberration and in as swift, decisive, and unemotional a fashion as possible.

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  • I am a therapist and I teach parenting skills classes...yelling and spanking are two things that are totally not taught in my classes.  They are outdated and teach kids the wrong message.  Developmentally, kids below a certain age won't understand your 'conversations'...they just can't get it.  And hitting them won't help.  I would suggest you read "Positive Discipline" - great book for parents on how to work with your children as opposed to working against them.  It's about setting boundries and teaching your kids to learn how to take control of their emotions (not that emotions are bad, but that there are better ways of expressing them).  It's a really great book that I believe in!
    image
  • image annabelle.27:

    I hate when people say this. If it didn't hurt, it wouldn't work.

     

    I don't think that's necessarily true.  I don't have kids, but I know that we used to discipline our dogs with a newspaper and swat their butts.  It didn't hurt them (I did it way harder on me to test it and it did not hurt) but it made a loud sound that scared them.  So it was the sound of it or the anticipation of the sound that scared them and made them eventually start behaving.  I'm not saying that it's the "sound" with kids, but I think there's also an element of the anticipation level of "being spanked" that scares them even if it doesn't hurt them or leave marks.

    Just to add, I'm not saying I "agree" with spanking, I'm just saying I was spanked occasionally as a child and I don't remember it ever hurting.  It was just something about the anticipation of it that was scary as hell.  Kinda like how I'm still petrified of needles/getting shots/giving blood.  I know it won't hurt but I'm still scared every time I have to get it done.

  • image MrsGinger:


    And- I gotta say.  It's illegal for a teacher to spank or swat or otherwise corporally punish a student.   It's also illegal to swat or spank another adult.  Why would I do to my child what I wouldn't do to anyone else? 

     

    Just so you know it is legal to spank in school in some areas. The Feds leave up to the states to decide and my state leaves it up to the school system. 

    I would never want to spank any of my students but I did an internship in a school that did spank and while I was there one of my student was spanked for lying by the principal.

     

    I am not saying that I think spanking it the right thing to do. I dont have any children of my own and DH and I dont plan on spanking our children. I just thought I would share something that not many people know.

  • image scherza:

    Actually, MrsG, corporal punishment is legal -- with written parental permission -- in several states.  A friend of mine taught in a school that paddled students for misbehavior.  In high school.  In 2010.

    That kind of blew my mind.

    OP, if you're still reading, I have to say that your goal -- not raising brats -- is good, but your philosophy is backwards.  If you focus on what you're going to do to curb negative behavior (i.e., spanking), then your focus is on the negative behavior all the time.  That will be exhausting for you and for the children concerned.

    If your focus is on promoting positive behavior, you will find that discipline is a much easier and less painful task.  Sure, you still have to correct negative behavior, but you have to do it less frequently, and since it isn't your focus point, you won't be so worn out when you have to deal with Junior dropping peas on the floor for the fifteenth time.  Think about what behaviors you want your children to embrace; model those behaviors; praise them to the skies when they do them; try to "catch them doing good"; and handle misbehavior as a brief aberration and in as swift, decisive, and unemotional a fashion as possible.

    Yes  x 1000.  It takes a lot more work, but you will raise children who well-behaved and respectful because the behaviors have been modeled, not because they fear getting smacked. 

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  • ask my husbands ex-wife how well spanking worked for her...it caused her to lose custody of her children.
  • I'm totally in favor of hitting children.
    image
  • image scherza:

    Actually, MrsG, corporal punishment is legal -- with written parental permission -- in several states.  A friend of mine taught in a school that paddled students for misbehavior.  In high school.  In 2010.

    That kind of blew my mind.

    Wow- that kind of blows my mind too.  I know it's illegal in my state, but when i just looked it up I discovered that apparently it was legal in one of the states I grew up in- I had no idea.  Interesting.

     

  • image Mrs.Faison:

    I think it's great that you and your Hubby are already discussing your future child rearing! Every child is different and so everyone will have a different opinion on the subject. It will help to read books about parenting when planning a family but in my experience parenting is a learn as you go process. Some children are go with the flow, most I'd say may be a bit more defiant. Our role as parents are to love and direct our children. Babies are not programmed with an understanding of right and wrong, safe and dangerous, that's your job as a parent. I always wince at those parents I see trying to reason with a toddler who is screaming their head off. There is nothing wrong with disciplining your child with a swift pat on the bottom when they misbehave, INO, and it seems like you already know that and would abuse your future children so I'm not sure why you're being virtually attacked.That's wack, ladies.

    My main parenting advice: 1. Love Unconditionally. 2. Don't be a punk parent.

     

     

    Thank you for being understanding we will spank our children only when they do something major. And only out of love never out of anger or for any other reason. But kids don;t know what is best for them as you said we as parents have to do all of it for them and so when they run out into the street they need a spanking to scare them into realizing that it is a serious issue. Would you rather spank your child? Or scrap them off of the street? It should be an easy answer and in serious situations spanking isn;t off of the table for us. Again though every family is different and needs to find what works for them. =] 

    Anniversary
    "A women who can kneel before the Lord can stand up to anything"
  • image LadyMadrid08:

    My qualification for spanking is that you don't spank out of anger and that you explain to the kid why they are being punished.  I mean sitting them down and having a talk with them about it before the spanking.  My dad always did this and then gave a spanking and I can honestly say I don't think any other way would have gotten through to me as a child.  There is a huge difference between getting angry at a kid and smacking them on the butt without explaining why and getting frustrated, taking the kid to the spanking place (mine was the bedroom), explaining why he's getting punished and then doling out punishment.  One way is controlled, the other is rash.

    So that's my 2 cents on this subject.  I fully plan to use spanking as a disciplinary measure if I think that's what will work with my children, but every kid is different so I have no idea yet.  My sister had like one spanking in her life and I needed....quite a few more to get the point across fully, but after a spanking I never, never, ever repeated the behavior.   

     

    Exactly how my parents did it as well. I would get sent to their room have a talk about what I did and then get my spanking. I made the connection that bad behavior = punishment.  And always when the spanking was over my dad would give me a hug and a kiss and tell me he loved me he was never angry he always talked calmly. Spanking is not the only form of punishment out there but it like anything else has a right and wrong way of being done.

    Anniversary
    "A women who can kneel before the Lord can stand up to anything"
  • image BunMom90:

    image lisa2008boo:
    That research is fine if that is what works for you and your family then that's fine you can raise your kids how ever you see fit. You have your rights and I have mine and until they make it illegal to spank my kids for severe bad behavior then it is the method I choose. Research is great but I find human experience to be more reliable. And everyone I know has been spanked all are productive members of society none are violent or have criminal issues besides minor things here and there. So it all depends on the family and the kids and whatever the parents finds works for them and there kids is what they should do every child is different. I may have a totally calm obedient child that only needs a warning and I don;t ever have to spank them. Or I may have one who bucks the system all the time and never wants to listen and will have to spank them. Different personalities make for different children.
    I'm not convinced that you are a normal, productive member of society. You sound angry, defensive and kinda clueless about early childhood development. 

    I was spanked as a child. I remember it. I don't remember what I did wrong or what I was supposed to learn. I just remember the spanking. I know it was the acceptable form of discipline back then, but there is so much more information today and better methods advocated today, that continuing the cycle of abuse (yes, its abuse) is absurd.  My own mother today would tell you it was wrong and she regrets it. I have raised two teens that are respectful, considerate, and kind and never once resorted to striking them.

    well if all you have is memories of getting spanked and you don;t even remember why then your parents weren't doing it right part of spanking the right way is to calmly explain to the child what the punishment is for. As I have already explained. And as for saying I am not normal or angry is very off you know nothing about me. This is a forum and all you see is typing you don't know the tone it is written in except what you put in your own head. So I suggest you stop judging me and making me out to be something when you have never met me in your life and every thing I've written here has been totally calm /casual discussion.

    Anniversary
    "A women who can kneel before the Lord can stand up to anything"
  • image ZestofLime:
    From the OP's bio: 
    Hey I'm Lisa I'm 20 Years old I just married my 8th grade sweet heart We don;t have any kids yet and don;t want any for awhile
     
     
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    You are really way too young to be a parent. Actually, a lot of women on these boards will tell you that you are way to young to be married.
     
    Please don't breed for at least another 5 years. Ten would be preferable in your case.

     

    My choice to get married is none of your business I've known my husband longer than most. I am of legal age to marry and that's all that matters and I will be 21 in 3 weeks so that's not uncommon. And as for kids I am not planning on having any for about 3 or 4 years I want to enjoy being married for awhile and get more financially stable and finish college. Thanks for the life advice but I have a plan and I'll stick to it.

    Anniversary
    "A women who can kneel before the Lord can stand up to anything"
  • My husband and I have also discussed this and decided that spanking is absolutely an option for us. It won't be our first response, but we both feel if it is warranted, we will spank. I know a lot of PPs are saying "look at the research," and I have. I also have first-hand knowledge of this as a former preschool teacher. I have been trained in and have practiced every method under the sun, as well as witnessed parents using various discipline techniques.

     It ALWAYS depends on the child for me. For some kids, time out works great, for others it's pointless. Just as for some children, spanking works great, and for others it's pointless. Same goes for the distraction technique, the positive modeling technique, and on and on. You can't read some research, choose one discipline philosophy that makes sense on paper, and leave it at that. You have to choose what's best for you and your individual child. So for us, spanking is not ruled out as an option.

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  • image AmandaWoodward:
    ask my husbands ex-wife how well spanking worked for her...it caused her to lose custody of her children.

     

    then she wasn't doing something right and was crossing into abuse because spanking - a pat on the rear with a flat hand....  is legal hitting any other body part or hitting with objects is crossing into abuse

    Anniversary
    "A women who can kneel before the Lord can stand up to anything"
  • image Estwd2:

    My husband and I have also discussed this and decided that spanking is absolutely an option for us. It won't be our first response, but we both feel if it is warranted, we will spank. I know a lot of PPs are saying "look at the research," and I have. I also have first-hand knowledge of this as a former preschool teacher. I have been trained in and have practiced every method under the sun, as well as witnessed parents using various discipline techniques.

     It ALWAYS depends on the child for me. For some kids, time out works great, for others it's pointless. Just as for some children, spanking works great, and for others it's pointless. Same goes for the distraction technique, the positive modeling technique, and on and on. You can't read some research, choose one discipline philosophy that makes sense on paper, and leave it at that. You have to choose what's best for you and your individual child. So for us, spanking is not ruled out as an option.

    I'm glade that I am not the only one talking about my husband on this issue. People have said to me "how can you talk about kids you don't even have" well it's important to make sure you agree on these things because if you don't and wait to find that out until after the child then it can cause fights between you and come between your marriage. You have to band together on a discipline plan and work together. And yes I also agree everything depends on the type of child. Thank you for sharing =]

    Anniversary
    "A women who can kneel before the Lord can stand up to anything"
  • image lisa2008boo:

    Thank you for being understanding we will spank our children only when they do something major. And only out of love never out of anger or for any other reason. But kids don;t know what is best for them as you said we as parents have to do all of it for them and so when they run out into the street they need a spanking to scare them into realizing that it is a serious issue. Would you rather spank your child? Or scrap them off of the street? It should be an easy answer and in serious situations spanking isn;t off of the table for us. Again though every family is different and needs to find what works for them. =] 

    I don't understand how you can spank out of love and not anger.  If you let your anger die down until you are calm, then the child probably will be as well, and you can do another type of punishment.  I can't see how it's possible to spank a child, knowing that you're physically hurting them, while feeling nothing but love. 

    If N ran into the street, you'd better believe the way I ran after her, the tone in my voice, and they way I told her to never do it again would have the same affect as a spanking.

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  • image lisa2008boo:

    But kids don;t know what is best for them as you said we as parents have to do all of it for them and so when they run out into the street they need a spanking to scare them into realizing that it is a serious issue. Would you rather spank your child? Or scrap them off of the street? It should be an easy answer and in serious situations spanking isn;t off of the table for us.

    That is a ridiculous thing to say. I'd rather my kid get spanked than killed, yes, but what you're not understanding is THOSE ARE NOT THE ONLY OPTIONS.

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